Curse

mazey vorstagg · Jun 30, 2008, 05:55 AM // 05:55

BTW, the reason wow has more lore is because it's paytoplay, because they hire people to write books about it and because there were 3 games before the release of the MMO.

P2P means that the artists are told to spend lots of time on each piece (mesh or texture). In WoW zones are crafted as whole zones whereas in GW they seem to me to landscape mesh with common objects dragged-n-dropped on it. Due to the time/money constraints in GW you end up with a lot of repeated models and skins and consequently lose out on lore.

WoW books basically don't make much new lore however they do take little snippets of wow lore and expand them to make it seem as though the whole franchise is steeped in lots of lore.

The three previous games are a huge lore booster, and i expect that the first 4 GW games will aid GW2 in putting out a lot more convincing lore.

The first GW games were thin as they though pve would be skipped over and the lore would be unimportant to players. With the coming of GW2 I think we'll see a ton of stuff explained and made up, lorewise.

Dru Stratas · Jun 30, 2008, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

If you can put 2 and 2 together in mystery stories like I can, then you can figure out the Lich's identity at no later then Riverside Province ending/Sanctum Cay mission, especially if you read on the lore of Orr's end and the source of the Orrian Undead. Them both wanting the Scepter of Orr and both being Orrian was the dead give-away for me.

Indeed, it was obvious after Sanctum Cay, however, up until that point, it was rather hidden. Another example of great lore, is how hidden Dhuum and Menzies are. I mean, we hear ALOT about them, but not alot at all really.

zwei2stein · Jun 30, 2008, 12:10 PM // 12:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dru Stratas

... Another example of great lore, is how hidden Dhuum and Menzies are. I mean, we hear ALOT about them, but not alot at all really.

Expansion hook: Conjure presence of X without defining it in detail. Bonus points if you manage to mention it a lot without saying anything.

Result? Both Dhuum and Menzies are well established and can be used as villains in (hypothetical) future chapters, but they are defined in such fuzzy way that they can be warped and modified to fit any background and any storyline.

Really, Prophecies is full of those links, some used, lots of unused, I mean, come on ... Margonites?

Nightow · Jun 30, 2008, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

Actually the Tome was explained in the manuscripts. After repeated attempts by the Stone Summit at unearthing it, Alkar went in and took it back to safety. Upon opening it he found out it not only contained the whole "speak the name and he appears" verse but also accounts of early days and the details of a final conflict where the Great Destroyer would rise and spread his minions across the world of Tyria.

Hmm... was this included with the EotN manuscripts or some where else?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

Sorry, simple typo, I know the difference. Kinda easy to type tomb instead of tome when you just finished reading on undead. Fixed it as well.

Hehe, no worries. It's just that when I posted that, I just had an argument with a guy in LA1 over the exact same thing. Boy was he stubborn...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

... Gonna have to reread the EN manual, been too long since I did. Still, they could have made an in game dialogue, like Alkar saying "I was a fool to read the name" or something.

Agreed, some reference in game would have been a lot better than leaving it all in the manuscripts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

He did not read the name. The passage makes it very clear that the Great Destroyer was going to rise at one point anyway (further evidenced by him being Primordus's "alarm clock"). Coincidentally this was going to be six years after the heroes buried it. Sometime in those six years, Alkar went back in,took it away and translated all of it, finding out about the battle that was supposed to transform the dwarven race forever. Which is the reason the Dwarves are already in action the moment we enter the tunnels.

Now that makes a whole lot of sense. As Azazel The Assassin said, all Alkar had to do was read the name, out loud otherwise. Still wonder what the dude's name was but I guess that's not really important now that we killed him.

Kemal X · Jun 30, 2008, 06:33 PM // 18:33

<-- too bored to read other posts atm, but I think reason for WoW lore interest is in their older games. Old Warcrafts had pretty nice lore, which makes fans more eager to continue in WoW. Altho my friend complained some time ago how "Wow spoils the story, as you get to kill all the cool guys" or something like that. Myself, I do enjoy GW lore. Sure, it could've been told better and with more facts, but hey, it leaves our Lore diggers work to do

Konig Des Todes · Jun 30, 2008, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

Hmm... was this included with the EotN manuscripts or some where else?

Just hinted by Odgen and mentioned in the EN manuscripts.

Quote:

Now that makes a whole lot of sense. As Azazel The Assassin said, all Alkar had to do was read the name, out loud otherwise. Still wonder what the dude's name was but I guess that's not really important now that we killed him.

Maybe it said his name was Primordus and Primordus is the real "Great Destroyer"? Possible, right?

Free Runner · Jun 30, 2008, 09:23 PM // 21:23

Or perhaps there was never such a thing as reading the name = it appears. You have to wonder how Alkar even knew that, as he would have to read out that part to know about it. And the book was supposed to have an enchantment sealing it anyway.

And again if he knew about it he would avoid reading the name hence "he never read the name".Aswell as that you have to read it aloud anyway and i would think as Chief Keeper, he would know not to. To me it sounds like he mistranslated this passage:

The Great Destroyer has been cast down into the Depths. Never again shall its name be uttered, lest it rise up and bring ruin down upon the world.
–Tome of Rubicon

Dru Stratas · Jun 30, 2008, 11:36 PM // 23:36

You know it's probably not the actual reading of the name of the Great Destroyer, it could be the fact that the Deldrimor Dwarfs don't want people to learn too much about the Great Destroyer. People knowing his name, could go hunting for him.

Therefore the "reading the name" is probably just a scare tactic, stopping Dwarfs/beings from discovering too much about the antagonist, the Great Destroyer himself.

Lawrence Chang · Jul 01, 2008, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Yep what lore.... still, you really expected it? Who cares if it ain't got ne lore. The PvE in this game is thin as hell for a reason -- it was never intended to be as deep as other MMORPGs. It was supposed to be a competitive PvP MMORPG, with PvE just packaged into it. Suddenly, PvP turns into a joke, and the majority of the people start playing for PvE.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 01, 2008, 03:12 AM // 03:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence Chang

Yep what lore.... still, you really expected it? Who cares if it ain't got ne lore. The PvE in this game is thin as hell for a reason -- it was never intended to be as deep as other MMORPGs. It was supposed to be a competitive PvP MMORPG, with PvE just packaged into it. Suddenly, PvP turns into a joke, and the majority of the people start playing for PvE.

I don't know which of the two were originally meant to be the primary of the game, as I joined playing about two years ago, during the Dragon Festival of '06. What I do know, is that the beta was mostly a PvE area, with, I believe, two or three arenas, and I do know that there was plenty of lore in Prophecies, but there were so many holes in it that allowed it to be expanded into other storylines, such as the little information on Cantha, Elona, Margonites, Forgotten, Titans, Ascalon vs Charr war, and eventually the Dredge were added.

How I see it, the game was originally meant to be PvE then PvP, the PvE being a large tutorial for skill usage and what-not. However, a good amount of people like story-lines and lore in general, whether they look for it and enjoy discovering it, or just simply reading it, just about everyone enjoys a good story. It is because of that more lore as been slowly put in, and the chances of lore being put in are increasing with time.

Is there lore? Yes. Can there be more lore? Of course. Is the current lore full of holes? Yes. Why do we want lore? Because it's interesting to those who want it.

With the tone I got when reading your post, Lawrence Chang, I take it that you don't like lore. If that is the case, please leave, no need for lore haters in the lore forum. If I'm misunderstanding, I apologize and request a revision to your post to not make it seem as what I take it to be, or an explanation/restating of the meaning of your post in a less hostile manner.

Proff · Jul 03, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Lore's overrated, I just play to kill stuff.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 03, 2008, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proff

Lore's overrated, I just play to kill stuff.

To each man his own. You want to play to kill stuff, do so, although I think Diablo and DOOM are games that are more of your style, at least the "kill kill kill" idea.

If you don't like lore, then you don't need to post in this forum, that being Druid's Overlook. Sadly, if people who didn't like lore didn't post in this forum, there would be very little posts because all the lore lovers that were ever at Guru moved to GWO to avoid such posts. Which I am starting to do too now >.>

zwei2stein · Jul 04, 2008, 09:20 AM // 09:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

... Diablo ...

Check out Diablo Lore, it is actually nice-quality one, but games just don't mention it

Konig Des Todes · Jul 04, 2008, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

Check out Diablo Lore, it is actually nice-quality one, but games just don't mention it

Diablo lore was the first game lore I actually bothered to read

. It is nice, however there is still little of it. As far as I can remember in Diablo 1, there are only 5 or so lore mentions, in the forms of tomes in the game. In Diablo 2, they have 4 excerts in the manual, along with a map of the world, or part, and some in-game stuff. So far for D3, they got a whole website page of it.

Diablo has nice lore, but a low amount as well as GW. But that doesn't change the fact that Diablo is a "kill kill kill" game like I said 2 posts above

Sai Rith · Jul 06, 2008, 01:27 AM // 01:27

The Lore doesn't suck. It's just how the system's emphasis on the Lore.